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#79700 - 08/27/10 05:04 PM Tips for First timers by First timers
Doug Sr Offline


Member

Registered: 12/16/02
Posts: 2331
Loc: Whitney
Hi Jna had some great ideals about training, gear, and other tips from the first trip. So as suggested this topic will be open to add what other first timers have found that worked or not and ideals they tried Thanks Doug

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#79723 - 08/29/10 07:57 PM Re: Tips for First timers by First timers [Re: Doug Sr]
bulldog34 Offline
Member

Registered: 07/26/09
Posts: 556
Loc: Atlanta
I've been a first-timer twice in the past couple of years: once in 2009 first attempting the mountain, and again this past summer actually reaching the summit for the first time. What I learned from that failed first attempt last year made all the difference in being able to stand on the summit a year later, feeling as good as I would have at sea level.

Obviously, the sound advice that can be had from members of this board and others is key. If you're attempting Whitney for the first time and are seeking advice, you will hear a steady mantra from the regulars in the Sierra on the following: train appropriately, acclimate well, hydrate often, and fuel the engine. I got just one of these four cornerstones right the first time and failed. I managed to get 3 of 4 right the next time and had no problems summitting. You may look at these four thoughts and say, "Yeah, sure - those are common sense." I did also - the first time.

Train Appropriately: 6150 feet of elevation gain and 6150 feet of elevation loss (an under-appreciated challenge until you're really tired and having to do it) in 22 miles. That's hard to train for. Being an avid and experienced hiker already, I put in over 250 training miles in the 6 weeks prior to Whitney my first time. No summit. Last month I summitted, but only put in about 85 training miles in the 6 weeks prior. The difference was in the quality of those miles. I hiked only the steepest trails with the most consistent elevation gain. The mileage itself was purely secondary. I wanted my legs screaming, 'cuz that's what I found to be the case my first attempt on Whitney. If you're in SoCal, your perfect training ground is not far away (Baldy, Gorgonio, Sanny J). Do these regularly, your legs will be ready. If you're in the east like me, it's a challenge to find those 2000 or 3000 foot gains for a workout. You have to, though - or spend endless hours on a Stairmaster or elliptical or stadium steps. Going for several 16-20 mile hikes on rolling terrain will not prepare you for the stress Whitney will put on your legs.

As much as possible, train with both the gear and the weight you plan to have with you on the mountain. More weight is better. Hauling 40-45 pounds at lower elevations prepares you better for the 30 you'll probably carry for a summer one-nighter at 10-12K' - trust me, it'll feel a helluva lot heavier than 30 pounds by Mirror Lake. Be comfortable with and have faith in all your gear before your big day. My first trip up the mountain I wore a pair of hiking pants I hadn't been in for quite a while. By Lone Pine Lake I noticed the zipper was broken. It was a huge distraction for me the rest of the day knowing that I was hiking Whitney with my fly open.

Acclimate Well: Having done a lot of recreational hiking in the west, as well as having been above 14,000 feet several times without even a hint of altitude illness, made me over-confident in this area. I did hike several Sierra trails in 2009 in the days prior to Whitney, getting to 12,000 feet with no problems - but I was sleeping in Lone Pine at about 3500 feet. On Whitney, the only event of AMS I've ever experienced hit me like a Mack truck at about 12,800 feet. Not a headache, or a headache with a little nausea, but the entire range of clinical symptoms - all severe. I was solo, and once I decided to turn back - just a couple dozen switchbacks shy of Trail Crest - the symptoms pretty much disappeared by the time I was below 10,000 feet.

I've since paid a lot more attention to this whole acclimatization thingy, not being as immune as I appear to have had myself convinced. The general high-altitude medical consensus is that the body acclimates best while sleeping. This year I spent the 5 nights prior to Whitney at or above 8000 feet, while doing the same type of 11-12K' dayhikes as the year before, and never once felt an AMS twinge. I was on the summit for about 45 minutes, just amazed at how good I felt. I'm absolutely convinced that sleeping high for several nights made a huge difference. AMS turns around more Whitney hikers than any other single issue (weather excepted) - do not overlook it. Get as high as you can for as long as you can before you head to the Portal, then try to get at least two nights' sleep above 8000 feet before heading up the trail. Three is better; one is a very dicey crapshoot. AMS is no fun - and neither is dragging your sorry ass to the parking lot in defeated misery because of it.

Diamox - it's up to you. I've never taken it, but I had it with me for last month's trip, just in case. It's best as a prophylactic aid, but the medical experts on this board will tell you that Diamox does provide some AMS symptom relief relatively quickly (15-30 minutes). Just having it in your pack can be a comforting thought. This year I took ginko biloba for two weeks prior to my trip - it's believed to help oxygenation at altitude. I have no idea if it helped, but it didn't hurt.

Hydrate Often: Simple and sound - just do it. Drink till you're peeing crystal clear and often the day before, and keep it up the entire time you're on the mountain. There's no lack of water the first 6 miles up - just be sure to carry a good 3 liters when you leave Trail Camp (or the spring on the twenty-somethingth switchback). The one thing I did right both times.

Fuel the Engine: I have no appetite above 12,000 feet. Many people don't. It's normal at this elevation. At some point on the trail you'll find that you have to force yourself to eat. You may want to run out to REI and buy lots of 'spensive, hi-tech, energy-efficient food products for your big day (or days) on Whitney. My advice: don't, unless you already consume the stuff regularly and like it. You'll find that you will not particularly want to eat foods you do like once you reach a certain altitude; new items or foods you don't particularly care for will almost certainly still be in your pack when you hit the Portal parking lot at the end (assuming the marmots didn't get them). Take what you like to eat. Period. If you don't, you probably won't eat.

Eating is a chore up there and takes more energy than you want to expend, but you have to fuel the engine. The figure I hear most often is 6000 - as in calories burned on a Whitney dayhike. That's a lotta calories. You've probably never burned that many in one day in your life, but you will if you get to the summit and back. Nibble, nibble, nibble - you will not sit down at Trail Crest at 13,600 feet and scarf down that 10-inch sub sandwich in your pack. A Clif bar at sea level ain't a Clif bar at 12,000 feet. I generally like tuna and string cheese, but at 13,000 feet they might as well be raw, diseased orc liver. I just will not eat much above 12,000 feet, and I didn't either time up the mountain. Remember how great I said I felt on the summit? My total food intake that entire day was one Quaker granola bar, 2 packets of GU, and a handful of peanut M&Ms. By the time I hit the Portal parking lot I was nauseous from having nothing in my belly all day but lots of sloshing water. One good puke and I was fine, but I could have avoided that if I had been more disciplined in eating.

My opinion about eating before a demanding hike like Whitney is simple - for two days prior I consume every complex carb in sight. Energy for the long haul in the form of pasta and breads. It'll still be with you even when your appetite disappears on the mountain. Simple, sugary carbs for quick energy the day of the hike are normal, but many people fail to build up a store of longer-lasting, easily-converted energy in those 48 hours before hitting the trailhead. Steak the night before Whitney has lots of nice protein, but it won't be with you at Trail Camp the next day - spaghetti, fettucini, pizza, rice, potatoes will. Next year I plan to take one of Doug's monster pancakes with me, broken up and stored in baggies. That, I can probably eat on the mountain. smile

All the Editor's Choice gear, best intentions, and backcountry bling in the world will not get you to the summit if you fail to appreciate and focus on these 4 things. Cover your bases on these and your chances of signing the summit register skyrocket. There's also a fifth cornerstone: common sense. Be aware, watch the weather, don't take stupid chances, and know when to turn around. Also, be kind to others on the trail - from packing out all your trash to keeping an eye out for those who may be in distress and need some assistance. As some very smart people on this board say, the summit is optional but the parking lot is mandatory.

Good luck!

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#79733 - 08/30/10 01:19 PM Re: Tips for First timers by First timers [Re: bulldog34]
DUG Offline
Member

Registered: 05/25/06
Posts: 415
Loc: Wildomar
"Nibble, nibble, nibble - you will not sit down at Trail Crest at 13,600 feet and scarf down that 10-inch sub sandwich in your pack."

I saw a guy do EXACTLY that on my last trip to Whitney. He wasn't a first timer though, he was an 89th timer.................................................DUG
_________________________
Everywhere is walking distance if you have the time. ~Steven Wright

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#79734 - 08/30/10 01:41 PM Re: Tips for First timers by First timers [Re: DUG]
bulldog34 Offline
Member

Registered: 07/26/09
Posts: 556
Loc: Atlanta
Let me guess, DUG - his first initial was Richard . . .

Uh, yeah - not a first timer. I'm sure Mr. Piotrowski has a well-adjusted high-altitude appetite.

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#79735 - 08/30/10 01:48 PM Re: Tips for First timers by First timers [Re: DUG]
kevroc Offline
Member

Registered: 09/24/09
Posts: 17
Loc: San Diego
These categories are great, some additional feedback.

Train Appropriately:
This is great advice. Work the leg muscles not just the distance. Training with a pack that's heavier than you plan on carrying will help, but go with hikes that have the steepest inclines. The stair machine at the gym is a great supplement as well.

Acclimate Well:
I used Diamox and didn't do any acclimation hiking. I didn't have the time to do the acclimation hikes and didn't want to chance it.

Hydrate Often:
But not too often. If you overdrink water you'll lower your sodium content and feel naseaus and want to puke. Not good.

Fuel the Engine:
The best way to do this is to do a hard hike and test different things out. You want something that wont upset your stomach, will metabolize quickly and give you some energy. My rule of thumb is to eat 1/2 the calores I will burn on the hike and let the other 1/2 come from stored calories. So I carbo load the day before and take enough with me for the other 1/2. If you don't manage that balance and force your body to consume itself you'll feel terrible coming down the mountain.


I'll add a few categories.

Watch your Exertion Level:
The harder you work the more water and food you need. There's also a limit to how long your body can work at that increased effort. You can easily cut your hydration and calorie needs in 1/2 just by reducing your effort level. You may wind up at the top in 8 hours versus 7, but you'll enjoy it much more.

Travel Light:
I can't believe some of the pack weights I read about. I went up with 13lbs for the day hike. I don't see the point of carrying an extra 5-10lbs that will make the hike that much harder.


Gear:
Use stuff that you can rely on, that you've trained with and you know works. Don't make last minute gear changes. When you start up Whitney you should feel like you've done this 100 times.


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#79737 - 08/30/10 02:01 PM Re: Tips for First timers by First timers [Re: DUG]
jna Offline
Member

Registered: 08/19/10
Posts: 6
Loc: California
In a nutshell I'm "guessing".....(this is my plan for next year)

1. Great cardio vascular system. Things that might help, running up hills/steep, stair climbing (lots), hiking steeps.
2. Conquer as many peaks above 10,000 as possible in the months before your Whitney attempt. In Southern California: Jacinto, Gorgonio, & Baldy
3. Know your suseptibility, if any, to AMS. Deal with it with Diamox, surplus oxygen, or other means.
4. Acclimate above 9,000 feet for at least 2-3 days before Whitney attempt.
5. Carbs before, during Whitney attempt.
6. Water and electrolytes before and during Whitney attempt.
7. Don't UNDERestimate the challenge
8. Don't go alone
9. Consider breaking up the attempt with overnights at Trail Camp on the way up and possibly on the way down.

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#79743 - 08/30/10 05:28 PM Re: Tips for First timers by First timers [Re: bulldog34]
Richard P. Offline
Member

Registered: 06/26/03
Posts: 4843
Loc: Ridgecrest, CA
Originally Posted By: bulldog34
Let me guess, DUG - his first initial was Richard . . .

Uh, yeah - not a first timer. I'm sure Mr. Piotrowski has a well-adjusted high-altitude appetite.


Geez, I'm going to develop a complex...

Doesn't beat the time I pulled out a large Pizza Factory Pizza box one morning (at Trail Crest) and invited people to join me. BeachAV8R knew it was about to happen. I think I remember that I didn't finish it off a Trail Crest, so I tried to share some more at the summit. (I wasn't about to carry it down!)

The point: As Gary stated, make sure you have things you will eat with you. And, don't bring too much! It's heavy, and will only get heavier.

Great post Gary. Doug sometimes comes up with some good ideas.

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#79746 - 08/30/10 06:05 PM Re: Tips for First timers by First timers [Re: kevroc]
Fred Johnson Offline
Member

Registered: 06/02/05
Posts: 14
Just a comment about taking Diamox; you should try it in as realistic a condition as possible before going to Whitney.

On the advice of my doctor, I took Daimox for the first time on a training hike up San Jacinto. I ended up in Little Round Valley (about a mile from the summit) nauseous and disoriented. It was not a pleasant experience, but I learned that Diamox does not work for me. I'm glad I did not learn that lesson at Trail Crest.


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#79748 - 08/30/10 07:36 PM Re: Tips for First timers by First timers [Re: kevroc]
bulldog34 Offline
Member

Registered: 07/26/09
Posts: 556
Loc: Atlanta
Originally Posted By: kevroc
Watch your Exertion Level:
The harder you work the more water and food you need. There's also a limit to how long your body can work at that increased effort. You can easily cut your hydration and calorie needs in 1/2 just by reducing your effort level. You may wind up at the top in 8 hours versus 7, but you'll enjoy it much more.


kevroc brings up a couple of other really key points. Pace is critical for most people the first time up this mountain. Once you're over 10,000 feet, and especially 12,000, you're in AMS-watch territory. Build up an oxygen debt in that thin air, and AMS is just waiting to pounce on your back. Your pacing, exertion and breathing rhythm need to be in balance as much as possible. If you're breathing too heavily, slow down. The better you're acclimated, the less critical pacing and exertion become, but until you're convinced otherwise always assume AMS is waiting right around the corner if you over-exert.

This 400-pound gorilla can't be predicted accurately; just because you might be an aerobic beast at sea level in marathons or cycling, you're statistically no less immune to AMS above 12K' than the 50-pound overweight couch potato. The surest way to avoid AMS is being at elevation for an extended period. Even sherpas in the Himalaya get AMS (or worse, one of the deadly edemas - cerebral or pulmonary), and they live their whole lives at extreme elevation. But going too high, too hard, too fast on Everest will bring them down every so often. AMS propensity is relative to the elevation you live and play at, not just elevation per se. People have been known to come down with it as low as 5000 to 7000 feet. If you've ever been to Aspen, Colorado you'll recall those popular "oxygen bars" in the town and on the surrounding ski runs - and Aspen is lower than the Portal, and the ski runs are less than 12,000 feet. No oxy-bars on Whitney, folks - gotta acclimate and pace.

That leads to the other point kevroc brings up - how long will it take you to complete your first dayhike of Whitney? That's really important because it dictates your start time. Remember, in the summer you don't really want to be on the summit - or the 2-mile ridge between it and Trail Crest - after 1:00 pm (unless you have a deep desire to be suddenly transformed into a crispy critter by lightning). That generally means summit by noon. When should you leave the Portal? Tricky question since you've probably never hiked an 11 mile trail up to 14,508 feet.

In Doug Thompson's book "Mountain Lore from the Whitney Store" (OK, that's another cornerstone - buy it well beforehand and read it at least twice - you're welcome Doug - the pancake's on the house my next trip out there, right?), he lands on a pretty well-accepted figure of 16 hours for a first-timer - 10 up and 6 down. Unless you have Rockies or Sierra experience hiking at high elevation, trust that number as a general rule. My first time up the mountain, that would have been about right if I had not turned back at 13,000 feet (12.5 hours total, some of it moving real slow with AMS). Ten hours before noon means hitting the trail at 2:00 am. Yeah, that sux, especially when you consider sleep loss and the effect it may have on you, but you gotta do it. That's another solid reason to get 2-3 nights' sleep at elevation before the hike. If you watch the Whitney-centric boards regularly, you'll see numbers reported often enough (6-8 hours up) that you may think they're the average for people like you. Don't believe it! Remember, this is your first time - assume you'll be 16 hours on the mountain and plan accordingly. I spoke with a lady on Whitney last month who told me her first dayhike on the mountain lasted 27 hours. She just took long rest breaks, as she put it - and seemed damned proud of it!

Over the course of this past summer I was privileged to spend some exceptional quality time with a few of the mountaineering icons of the Whitney/Eastern Sierra area - Laura Molnar, Richard Piotrowski, Jack and Betsy Northam, Jim Freeland, Tom Brown, Rick Graham - and Doug Thompson of course. I have no clue how many Sierra or Whitney summits this small group accounts for, but it's mind-boggling. These people can get up and down Whitney in the blink of an eye, figuratively speaking. Jack Northam, who regularly doubles the Whitney Trail (yes, up and down twice in one day - 44 miles and 12,300 feet of elevation gain and loss), typically makes the summit in less than 4 hours, and he's in his early 60s. I know Richard has done a double or two as well. Jack and Richard both are right at 90 summits each, the last I heard. Betsy has 45. God only knows how many times Doug has seen the summit over the years. These folks can fly up and down the mountain because that's what they do. As a first-timer it's important to keep posts by folks of this caliber, and any times they might mention, in perspective. We mere mortals should assume that 16-hour day for our first stroll up mighty Whitney!

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#79749 - 08/30/10 08:12 PM Re: Tips for First timers by First timers [Re: Doug Sr]
phycon Offline
Member

Registered: 03/25/09
Posts: 42
Loc: CA. USA
My first time was last year, at the age of 53. There were 5 of us and we safely made it to the top of Mt Whitney and back in one day.
Aside from the 5 training hikes there were two things that was the most helpful:

Electrolytes. I tried many varieties but my fav was Gatorade. I drank whenever I wanted to but made sure I drank every 15 min. I also carried water.

Camelbak backpack. Drinking electrolytes out of this is so easy. The food I carried was Beef Jerky, Peanut Butter Sandwich and peanut M&Ms. The only thing I ate on the trail was the M&Ms every 15 mins. I ate half the sandwich at the summit.

I'll have to say that training with electrolytes was a real game changer. Another thing that was helpful was staying at Cottonwood, 10,000 ft several nights before the hike. We camped at the Portal the night before.


Edited by phycon (08/30/10 08:25 PM)

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#79750 - 08/30/10 08:19 PM Re: Tips for First timers by First timers [Re: Richard P.]
bulldog34 Offline
Member

Registered: 07/26/09
Posts: 556
Loc: Atlanta
Richard, Whitney is your personal 2-plus-mile high dining room. I would naturally expect you to eat there as comfortably and well as you do at home. The 89th summit comment was the lock though . . . that, and having read the TR re you, DUG and his son on the MR last week smile

This first-timer-specific thread pinned to the top of the first page was a wonderful idea. I recall in late 2008 and 2009 having to search all over the message board for posts that were relevant to me as an impending first-timer. Maybe that first trip would have gone a little differently if I had seen a single, specific thread that felt comfortable to me as a Whitney newbie to ask the right questions and read others' first time experiences.

And Doug's big-ass pancake was a pretty good idea too. And the big-ass burger, and the one-of-a-kind fries, and . . .

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#79752 - 08/30/10 08:31 PM Re: Tips for First timers by First timers [Re: DUG]
Akichow Offline
Member

Registered: 04/07/10
Posts: 685
Loc: Confluence of the Sac and Am R...
I am hoping to be a first timer this Monday, if the weather holds. Meanwhile, I've done two things this summer that have substantially upped my confidence and helped me plan better: I climbed White Mountain, and I climbed Mt. Whitney to Trail Camp. I found out some important about me and altitude in the process, described below. (For reference, I am a 40-something female who just got into this type of hiking within the last year and bagged my first 14'er on August 1, 2010.)

WHITE MOUNTAIN

At 14,252, White Mountain is just shy of Whitney.

1. TIP: I climbed the first Sunday in August, which is always a special day on White Mountain -- they open the Barcroft gate, which enables you to shave 4 miles off what is usually a 14 mile hike, so that it is a 10 mile hike instead.

2. APPETITE: I discovered I have a huge appetite at high altitudes (no, I am not DUG), at least when I am properly acclimatized. When some guy offered me some canned grape leaves on a switchback at 13,600 feet (how surreal is that?), I accepted and scarfed some down. A few minutes later, at the summit, I scarfed down a barbeque chicken breast sandwich, a pack of trailmix, and a KIND bar.

3. SLEEP APNEA: I discovered I have altitude-related sleep apnea (a/k/a periodic breathing, Cheyenne Stokes breathing) at 12,000 feet, where the usual White Mountain trailhead is located. I understand that this is actually a sign of the body's adaptation to altitude, not AMS. However, it is annoying and leaves you tired if you keep waking up in the middle of the night. An easy solution for me: 125 mg of Diamox. An hour later, I was sleeping peacefully.*

4. The trip was easier than I thought. It helped build my confidence.

MT. WHITNEY TRAIL CAMP

In Mid July, I snagged a last minute overnight permit and climbed to Trail Camp with my dog (overnighting in Outpost Camp). This trip was great for several reasons.

1. Scoping out the trail was important and caused me to change my plans. Now, when I do my summit attempt on Monday, I am going to camp either at Outpost Camp again, or possibly at Consultation Lake, rather than Trail Camp. Outpost Camp is beautiful and quiet, and the hike past Outpost Camp is more pleasant without a heavy pack.

2. I met Bob R., a regular poster here, while I was at Trail Camp. Meeting people who know the mountain on the trail is fun and also confidence-boosting.

3. Again, this hike was less hard than I thought it would be, further building confidence.

*A note about drugs. Based on my own research, reviewing posts here, consulting with a high altitude specialist (MD), and consulting with my PCP, I decided to carry a small selection of specialized drugs for "just in case," including Diamox (though not to take anything prophylactically, but to rely on proper acclimitization instead). And I was sure glad I had the Diamox with me when the sleep apnea hit on White Mountain. I had first tested it, at sea level, to make sure I had no adverse reactions (I am allergic to sulfa-containing antibiotics), but had not planned to take it at altitude until the apnea hit.

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#79754 - 08/30/10 10:16 PM Re: Tips for First timers by First timers [Re: bulldog34]
bobpickering Offline
Member

Registered: 03/30/09
Posts: 272
Loc: Reno, NV
I can only add that Bulldog34 has done his homework, picked the brains of all the right people, and done an excellent job of presenting what he has learned. Nice job, Gary.

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#79755 - 08/31/10 06:01 AM Re: Tips for First timers by First timers [Re: bobpickering]
bulldog34 Offline
Member

Registered: 07/26/09
Posts: 556
Loc: Atlanta
Thanks Bob - a 10-day 4000-mile round trip built around climbing this mountain, combined with a winter brooding on failing to reach the summit, can be an enormous motivator to learn properly. In all the hiking I've done over the years, that was the one time I failed to finish a planned route due to inadequate preparation. Lesson learned.

And speaking of notable doubles, have you changed your mind about doing another MR double? When I grow up, I want to manage just one trip up the MR . . .

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#79756 - 08/31/10 06:39 AM Re: Tips for First timers by First timers [Re: bulldog34]
hightinerary Online   content
Member

Registered: 01/02/03
Posts: 709
Loc: Maryland
Are you really going to be able to wait another year, Bulldogxxxiv? Obviously you can't get Mt. Whitney out of your mind...

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#79758 - 08/31/10 07:20 AM Re: Tips for First timers by First timers [Re: hightinerary]
bulldog34 Offline
Member

Registered: 07/26/09
Posts: 556
Loc: Atlanta
Hey man, after summitting I'm now balanced and patient - it's my wife that has the fever. That night when I taxied you, Laura and Jim to Horseshoe Meadow, she was hatching plans with Doug and the crew at the Portal for her first trip up the mountain next year (past Lone Pine Lake, anyway).

Besides, I'll be there in February for my annual Death Valley camping/hiking trip. Joe Q and I may snowshoe up to the Portal one day, just so I can get a little Whitney fix smile

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#79760 - 08/31/10 09:41 AM Re: Tips for First timers by First timers [Re: bulldog34]
bobpickering Offline
Member

Registered: 03/30/09
Posts: 272
Loc: Reno, NV
Gary:

We're getting off the topic a little here, but you should approach the MR the same way you approached your successful trip this summer: Learn all you can about the route (or go with someone who knows it) and work on rock climbing skills.

Go to your local climbing gym, practice scrambling up and down whatever easy rocks you can find near Atlanta, and get somebody to take you top roping at a local crag. Climb some class 3 routes during the week before Whitney the next time you're here. You can even scope out the north fork as far as LBSL without a permit. The more practice you get, the easier the MR will seem when you get there.

If you do your homework, you probably won't have much trouble talking Laura, Richard, or me into going with you.

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#79761 - 08/31/10 10:23 AM Re: Tips for First timers by First timers [Re: bobpickering]
quillansculpture Offline
Member

Registered: 04/04/09
Posts: 236
Loc: CA
Gary..... MR???? I still haven't had the nerve to get past the e-ledges. I'll go if you go. I did find it funny in one post in which the hiker had done the MR twice. The first time was in the dark and he didn't even see the exposure on the e-ledges. The second was in the light of day and it scared the crap out of him.

Gary....give me a date :-) I'll let you be the person who holds my sweaty hands.
_________________________

"Turtles, Frogs & other sculpture raised in a Gallery-friendly Environment"

http://www.quillansculpturegallery.com

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#79762 - 08/31/10 10:26 AM Re: Tips for First timers by First timers [Re: bobpickering]
DUG Offline
Member

Registered: 05/25/06
Posts: 415
Loc: Wildomar
I agree with Bob 100% about going in with someone who knows the way. While we probably could have found the route, it would have added stress and time to the trip. Also it was great having someone knowledgable point out and name all the great stuff we were looking at.

We didn't doing any pre hike rock climbing practice and it didn't seem to slow us down. Mike asked a lot of questions about hand and foot placements, but that's more due to him being a chatty kid than anything else. I'm a total rock climbing noob and had no problems following along - your milage may vary..........................................DUG
_________________________
Everywhere is walking distance if you have the time. ~Steven Wright

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#79763 - 08/31/10 10:28 AM Re: Tips for First timers by First timers [Re: quillansculpture]
DUG Offline
Member

Registered: 05/25/06
Posts: 415
Loc: Wildomar
Originally Posted By: quillansculpture
Gary..... MR???? I still haven't had the nerve to get past the e-ledges. I'll go if you go. I did find it funny in one post in which the hiker had done the MR twice. The first time was in the dark and he didn't even see the exposure on the e-ledges. The second was in the light of day and it scared the crap out of him.

Gary....give me a date :-) I'll let you be the person who holds my sweaty hands.


I'm supposed to go back up the MR route in September - in the day light. We'll see if it bothers me then. It was easy in the dark................................DUG
_________________________
Everywhere is walking distance if you have the time. ~Steven Wright

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